The Dan 'Shoe’ Hsu interview
Back in 2021 I jumped on a ZOOM call with the legendary Dan ‘Shoe’ Hsu.
These days Dan works for Blizzard Entertainment as a Senior Director. But I wanted to ask him about his former life as a writer and editor for Electronic Gaming Monthly (EGM) magazine back in the 90s and 2000s.
He joined the publication in 1996, rose through the ranks, and ended up serving as editor from 2001 until 2008.
The article I wrote focused on the global reach (and influence) of EGM, arguably the biggest gaming publication in the world at the time.
That focus meant I had to cut some of the more interesting anecdotes Dan shared. Like the time Acclaim pulled advertising over his review of Turok on N64. Or when Capcom threatened to do the same because of Street Fighter.
So anyway, here’s the interview in full*. The original article is here.
How did you get the gig with EGM and what was your background beforehand?
“I was out of college and I didn’t really know what I wanted to do. I had studied statistics but [didn’t want to pursue that as a career].
“I was a big video gamer, an EGM reader, and my girlfriend at the time suggested I apply at companies that I would like to work for, rather than where I could apply my college education. I sent my resume and cover letter to maybe 20 companies; game companies, game outlets such as EGM, etc.
“Nothing happened, so I thought that was just a bust. But then nine months later I got a call from the editorial director at EGM, Joe Funk. He said he really liked my cover letter, which basically said ‘I’ll do whatever’. I thought maybe [he was calling about a marketing position], but he said they were looking for writers, and asked me to turn in some more writing samples.
“I thought it was a joke at first, like maybe one of my friends was pranking me. Anyway, I sent through some samples, he liked them, asked me to come down for an interview, and I got the job.”
Which magazines did you read growing up? EGM, Nintendo Power?
“Both. EGM was my favourite, it was my number one. My second favourite was probably Next Generation. I read them both regularly before I got into the industry. Then Nintendo Power further after that, and occasionally other magazines like Gamepro or Game Informer, GameFan. But mostly EGM and Next Gen.”
Were UK magazines a factor in the US market? Did you see them as competitors (once you joined EGM)?
“There were a lot of influential magazines abroad, like Edge, Famitsu in Japan, that we knew by reputation, but we never got the sense that they had huge distribution [especially in the US].
“The advantage EGM had as an American magazine is we had a much larger market, just population wise. [Also], the impression I had was that our distribution was a little bit more advanced, so we were able to get some magazines overseas, and that had a snowball effect, where we had a broader audience, had a larger audience, so we were able to secure more exclusives.
“You had magazines like Next Gen or Edge, that were positioned as more prestigious, where they could secure exclusives or interviews based on their brand [name]. That was considered a PR win for a publisher to get coverage in [those magazines].
EGM was a little more mainstream, and so the magazine had a wider reach, and once you start getting those exclusives your readership expands, and the success builds upon itself.”
Did the UK and US markets approach sales and distribution in different ways?
“One of the things we always talked about was the newsstands sales, and for them to be a bigger deal for the English market. Like, I know in the US we really drove hard for subscriptions, we also had a big newsstand model, but in the UK, they’re very newsstand driven. [That meant] a lot of the business was including goodies and bonus products [with your magazine] to try and convince people to pick up that copy, because there was more competition there on the newsstands vs the US.
How important was the ad sales revenue vs newsstand sales and subscriptions?
“I don’t know exactly, I didn’t work in that department. But if you look at our ad sales department vs the circulation department, the ad people were way more important, they had the budget to go do things, they had the bigger team. You weren’t making much money from subscriptions. Subscriptions are mainly to drive up the circulation numbers. Newsstands you made more money because with subscriptions you’re selling each issue at a significant discount, you have to mail them out, etc. But the main business was to get as many readers as possible, so you could sell ad pages at a higher premium.”
Why is EGM so fondly remembered?
“I know for me, as a reader, like even before I worked there, one of the reasons I read it was they always seemed on top of everything new that was coming out. They had sections about what’s coming from Japan, and as a gamer you get excited, like, ‘Oh, I hope this product will come to the US market so I can play it’.
“You’d get to read about these things you wouldn’t have access to otherwise. This is the 90s, pre-internet, and this is where you’re getting all the information from. EGM was very aggressive about global coverage vs just a domestic market.
“Another thing is they were very much about letting the personalities of the writers shine. So whether that was the rumours section with Quarterman, or Trickman Terry, or the reviewers, you kinda got to know them by name, almost. When I went and interviewed at EGM, I was like, “Oh, your [insert name], I’ve been reading your stuff, I know who you are.” They let their personalities shine.
What about the 4-person reviews? Those were unique (at least in the west).
“I know the review crew was really popular. Famitsu had a similar format, so EGM stole that format, and each game would get a little right-up. It’s kinda counter-intuitive, you get very little information, but you see 3 or 4 scores right away, so you get a good feel for what the magazine or staff think of that game.
For me, as a reader, EGM felt like a trusted source of news and information. Did you ever have to push back against advertiser pressure with reviews or coverage?
“I remember reading an editorial by Steve Harris, who’s the original owner, about how Capcom was going to pull ads from EGM because they weren’t happy with coverage for Super Street Fighter 2 for Super Nintendo, or one of the later editions of Street Fighter 2. Apparently EGM wasn’t kind to [the game] in its review coverage. I think the critique was that it was rehashing a lot of old ideas.
“Anyway, Capcom threatened to pull advertising. Now, the traditional thinking is you pull advertising, you threaten that loss of revenue, and that magazine will cave, or be friendlier to you. Instead, EGM wrote an editorial outing this, and just saying, “We don’t care. Capcom can pull the ads. Our service is for you, the reader.”
“When I was interviewing for the job I asked the editorial director, Joe Funk, about this and “How do you handle the pressure?” I remember this very clearly, he said, “The bottom line, you take care of the readers and the advertising will come. If you’re honest and transparent to the readers, the loyalty will build, the readership will grow, and advertisers will have no choice but to go to you, because you have the numbers and you have the reach.”
“When I started writing for EGM, I remember I was one of the lower reviews for Turok on Nintendo 64, and I didn’t know this until years later, that Acclaim pulled advertising because of my review.
“But this is how the magazine was set up. The advertising department was not allowed to share that with us, because they didn’t want to put pressure on us to be more favourable. So it was about keeping those two worlds very separate, so that there’s no undue influence about what we write about, or how we score things, or how we cover Acclaim products in the future.”
“So I learned those lessons, and we made policies around them, so that the bottom line is the product has to be very honest, and be full of integrity and be true to the readers.”
Read the full EGM article here.
*Going into this interview the focus was always about EGM vs the UK magazine market, hence the nerdy, very specific questions.
